[MLB-WIRELESS] grumpy people

Wed Jan 9 15:05:57 EST 2002

Wireless internet at work I am interested...Who did you end up using?
Simon Hall

-----Original Message-----
From: Lucas Lozo [mailto:lucas.lozo at cdt.com.au]
Sent: Wednesday, January 09, 2002 2:25 PM
To: melbwireless at melbwireless.dyndns.org
Subject: RE: [MLB-WIRELESS] grumpy people

I understand that.
I just think with out some sort of control or regulation (which cannot
be run successfully for Free), The will be abuse and degredation of the
network.

Wireless lan is almost like the hay day of CB radio, at its peak CB
radio was useless to try and use and most channels were always
cluttered, except now you will have a service that is dependant on some
one else having system up and running, and if they get the sads, go away
or what ever, you will have a group of people that will have no service,
or poor service.
Just like having a cheap ISP provider who over sells his ISP bandwidth
and dial access for low cost.
How many of these ISP's are around today?? A lot have gone or got taken
over.
Their Customers get pissed with poor service and move over to dearer
providers, irrespective that the access was cheap or free.

Don't get me wrong, i think the concept is great, but without some
guidlines, control and admin, as well as some fixed infrastructure (and
this cannot be created with a cost) they whole project will eventually
die.
Then you also have the all mighty $ to compete with as far as $ hungry
corporates with government push to impose new regulations that can kill
off the whole venture.
My place of work has one of the best locations in the eastern suburbs
for antenna coverage, we are slightly higher the telstra's facility at
Surrey Hills, from here we can cover most of the eastern suburbs, we
have just ordered and soon to be installed a Wireless Internet service,
however in looking into wireless technology, to get a reliable service
going, it is not a sub $500 project, but will in reality cost close to
$2K.
Then there our council Bylaws to comply with such as maximum height of
antenna, height that require a permit, etc etc etc. these all cost $$$.

At the end of the day, you get what you pay for.

But i see with a "free" service performance, reliability are real issues
as well as Leeches, hackers and other destructive people.

I also remember when I first got onto Telstra Cable, It was a great
service when it first started, (I got into it when it was still Beta
test ), Initial marketing was 100 times the speed of a 33k modem, all
local traffic free, all email traffic free etc etc, and in the early
days it did deliver what they claimed, a few years down the track,
Nothing is free on it, Banned local traffic, charging on all traffic
including email, so even when telstra mail you a notification, you get
charged, speed, oh what a joke that is now, telstra capped the speed
256Krec 64K send, (on the basic plan) and at many times transfer speed
is worse than a 56K modem. And this all happened on a comercial high
priced "service"!

So just how many people are actively using the wirelass lan now? how
many last month?

-----Original Message-----
From: Adrian Close [mailto:adrian at close.wattle.id.au]
Sent: Wednesday, 9 January 2002 1:17 PM
To: melbwireless at melbwireless.dyndns.org
Subject: RE: [MLB-WIRELESS] grumpy people

Lucas,

You need to think outside the 802.11-to-provide-wireless-Internet-access
box.  It's not just about sharing cable connections.  It can also be
about
building a network to share resources within the network.  For example:

- messaging (email, video conferencing, instant messaging, chat, et al)
- gaming
- mirrors
- etc.

On Wed, 9 Jan 2002, Lucas Lozo wrote:

> Its a expensive cost to a individual who wants to create a node for
the
> benefit of others.

Not really.  The expense is somewhat proportional to the service an
individual wants to provide.  At one end, you can simple whack a card in
a
machine and provide service to whoever happens to be in range.  Or you
can
convert disused AM broadcast towers to 802.11... :)

And the service itself can be whatever you feel like provide - just
access
to some local data, perhaps.  Or access to a larger network at whatever
data rate you feel is appropriate.

> To someone that has thrown in $$$ in creating a access point will want
> some resonable bandwitch for him self (why should he not if he
invested
> a number of dollars).

Yup.  So limit the bandwidth you make available to others and reserve
some
for yourself.  The technology exists.

> Reliability, how can other (users, leeches etc..) rely on a access
point
> that is situated in some one else home, if he turns it off, goes on
> holidays or locks up etc.

Don't rely on anything.  This is the co-operative anarchy part of the
equation.  If it's there, use it.  If it goes away, replace it.  If you
don't like it, fix it.

> who is going to regulate what uses get on and control their bandwidth
> usage..

Everyone and no-one.  If you don't want to provide access to other
people,
don't.  If you want to charge for it, fine (but make sure you've jumped
through the legal hoops).  Your site's policy is your own.  If it's
interesting to other people, they'll use it.  If not, they won't, and
that's fine too.  Hopefully you at least will get something out of your
own site, otherwise there's little point in running it!  :)

> You can have all the best intentioned people you like involved which
all
> all good and great, but there will always a few individuals who will
> ruin the service for a number of reasons.

Yup.  And I can really ruin your day with a 2.4GHz noise source too.

Simply not doing something because someone _might_ ruin it runs contrary
to the human spirit.  Why do anything?  The Sun is going to go nova and
toast everything anyway.

But we don't all sit at home gibbering in fear of the bright light in
the
sky.  We get off our butts and do stuff.  Because we can.  Because it's
fun.  Because, as humans, we need to feel a sense of achievement.

Think about it.

Adrian Close			email:	adrian at close.wattle.id.au
1 Old Gippsland Rd.		web:
http://www.close.wattle.id.au/~adrian
Lilydale, VIC, 3140, Australia	mobile:	+61 412 385 201

Echelon teaser: MD5 RX-7 SSL Kiwi TRD DEADBEEF Bubba

--
To unsubscribe, send mail to minordomo at melbwireless.dyndns.org with a
subject of 'unsubscribe melbwireless'  
Archive at:
http://melbwireless.dyndns.org/cgi-bin/minorweb.pl?A=LIST&L=melbwireless
IRC at: au.austnet.org #melb-wireless

--
To unsubscribe, send mail to minordomo at melbwireless.dyndns.org with a
subject of 'unsubscribe melbwireless'  
Archive at:
http://melbwireless.dyndns.org/cgi-bin/minorweb.pl?A=LIST&L=melbwireless
IRC at: au.austnet.org #melb-wireless

-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: winmail.dat
Type: application/ms-tnef
Size: 5624 bytes
Desc: not available
URL: <http://lists.wireless.org.au/pipermail/melbwireless/attachments/20020109/81c85f98/attachment.bin>